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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
 Posted - 03 Jul 2012 : 3:44:40 PM
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The HMRAV will run its new series at the upcoming Southern Classic. It will run the series within the P4 Unlimited solo events.
I need help to document bikes suitable so we can then chase them dow;
650cc
Triumph
BSA
Norton
Yamaha
Moto Morini
750cc
Truimph
BSA
Norton
Yamaha bored
Laverda
H-D
If there are 1000cc machines let me know
The club did run a push roid class earlier, would that be something to look at, give me ideas please.
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John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
Edited by - john on 03 Jul 2012 6:05:46 PM |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 03 Jul 2012 : 5:15:55 PM
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John, would it not be better to combine P3 and P4?
At least this would get similar bikes racing together even if technically in separate races.
In fact, as this is about the type of bike, Thunderbike, why not open it up to all periods and run it as a feature race? |
125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
Edited by - john feakes on 04 Jul 2012 08:48:31 AM |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jul 2012 : 09:11:03 AM
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I sufggest we approach the HMRAV committee with that one. Perhaps a letter to me?
I think they are agreeable to a start on the idea, as it stands there can be no trouble with people arguing at the start line. Maybe thats a good start to the idea. If riders want more, it would help if they bring the topic up.
Currently it is being fitted into the existing racve structure without additional races.
The HMRAV already runs a full program.
Thsi plan will simply fill up empty spots on the grid and thats a good idea. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jul 2012 : 10:05:59 AM
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John, for it to fill empty spots on the grid something has to change.
Either it brings new bikes or it is cross period.
Running it as cross period is far more likely to succeed, given the short lead time, than trying to find new bikes.
If it is seen to be a success it is highly likely that the new bikes will come because they have somewhere to race. |
125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jul 2012 : 11:00:33 AM
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| As I said, please write a case for the idea and I will pass it on. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jul 2012 : 1:48:20 PM
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I will do that in the form of an email.
Done. |
125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
Edited by - john feakes on 04 Jul 2012 2:05:47 PM |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 11 Jul 2012 : 1:39:44 PM
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| Any developments? |
125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 11 Jul 2012 : 9:05:18 PM
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They will stick to the plan at this stage of P4 log booked bikes only entering the P4 /P5 Unlimited event. Depending how it develpos things will be modified.
It all depends on blokes entering bikes whether they are 650, 750 and 1000 machines. So the plan is in place I hope people step up to the mark. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jul 2012 : 08:10:30 AM
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I am confused.
"P4 log booked bikes only entering the P4/P5 Unlimited event".
Does this mean that it is a sub class within an existing event?
If it is merely recognition of some of the bikes that normally run in a combined P4/P5 race it only means more of the same.
Nothing has changed, just a few more trophies to be won.
I am very disappointed by the lack of vision. |
125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jul 2012 : 11:49:14 AM
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Yes.
The bikes we are seking are not racing at the moment, IE Yammy 650, Pommy 650 Twins and other machines.
The plan involves putting up a trophy for them, based on numbers entering, just as the HMRAV has done with sub classes of sidecars.
The real issue is that over recent years many people have complained about "not being able to win, so I am staying at home"
The HMRAV committee feels the offer will cahllenge such people to put up and race.
It took about 5 years to get the 125 blokes to help themselves, so I hope it takes less time for this sub class.
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John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jul 2012 : 12:56:05 PM
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The problem is that nothing has changed.
Surely it needs to be a stand alone thunderbike class open to all suitable bikes regardless of period.
Why would anyone want to race a "thunderbike" in a P5 superbike race?
So that they can be made to look slow?
If that's what they wanted they would be there now.
They are NOT.
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125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jul 2012 : 1:07:44 PM
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| John, the reason the 125 riders "helped themselves" was that the HMRAV committee, in its wisdom, sought to put them in an unacceptable situation. |
125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jul 2012 : 2:15:17 PM
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| The issue of Thunder bikes in P5 solo races was dicussed. The plan will be to see what enters and then make changes to suit safety and grid number positions. Its no good having a separate race for jsut 5 bikes, which was the same isue with the 125's. We ran surveys of 125 riders and got 2 distinct camps with completey different views. In that case the 125 riders were told, get the numbers up and you may be able to have a separate race. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jul 2012 : 09:35:12 AM
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John, at last year's Southern Classic there was one guy riding a Moto Guzzi in a field of 4 cylinder P4 and P5 Superbikes.
He managed to finish 11th of 13 finishers and had been lapped by most of the field. There were 15 bikes in the P3 unlimited class.
These 15 would be the platform on which to build, not the one guy in the P4/P5 race.
In this race the Guzzi would have finished around 5th. |
125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
Edited by - john feakes on 13 Jul 2012 09:52:56 AM |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jul 2012 : 2:13:11 PM
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Dont forget we run races within races. It all will depend on who enters what.
At least the club has made room for them, stop complianing and get you bikes out please? |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jul 2012 : 4:18:18 PM
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The race within a race was the P4 and P5 combined "superbike" event with only one bike that would qualify as a "thunderbike".
This category of racing has nothing to do with thunderbikes and it will take a miracle to get such bikes to compete in an event that they will be outclassed in.
I wish you luck but fear that it will be an excercise in futility.
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125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jul 2012 : 5:26:46 PM
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| John, did you spend last weekend with Alan in Benalla, I just ask you let the racers get them selves sorted out and give it ago. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jul 2012 : 11:18:31 AM
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John, that is precisely what I intend to do.
I hope it is a success. |
125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
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OldKwak
Level 2 Member
Victoria
156 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2012 : 07:48:19 AM
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The day of Alan and John Feakes has passed. They wont get back on their bikes, they will only comment from the sidelines - and good luck to them. I saw Alan yesterday at Winton where I was racing against moderns on my old Z and having a great time I might add - completely outclassed against some of the best club racers in the land giving away 40hp. He had the same opportunity as I did but chose not to race. John wasn't there either, same opportunity again, not there. People who own bikes that fit into this proposed class are being given a wonderful opportunity, sure they won't be out front (or maybe they will be) but they can, like I had on the weekend, be guaranteed a great time. John forget the whinging and just do it I am sure all the owners of unit Triumphs etc will love you for it.
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2012 : 09:44:17 AM
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Peter, there are two different subjects being discussed.
One is getting unit construction Triumphs and other similar bikes racing where they should be and this one is about a Thunderbike class.
I do not have any particular interest in either but I do have an interest in the sport I love.
What I have sought to do is offer constructive ideas to bring about change.
Please read through my comments and see if I am just whinging.
Remember, we are trying to attract those who are not currently turning out.
There must be a reason (or many) for this.
We must ask "why is it so?"
My theory is that as long as things stay the same nothing will change.
You are probably right about my day being over, I am rapidly approaching my 75th birthday and my bike has an appetite for cash that my income can't support.
What I do have to offer is time, experience and a love of racing.
I want to see improvements.
Regards, John
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125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
Edited by - john feakes on 16 Jul 2012 09:48:36 AM |
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JasonL
Level 3 Member
Victoria
240 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jul 2012 : 8:03:31 PM
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"As long as things stay the same nothing will change"
That's magic that is! |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jul 2012 : 11:01:47 PM
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Nothing is staying the same.
The HMRAV once again is trying something different, its not what everybody may want, but its another effort to attract more bikes.
If people drag more bikes out of the shed to race it will have proved its worth, if others stay at home because they cant WIN, then there is nothing we can offer them!
I am aware many people race because they just enjoy the competition and the camaraderi |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jul 2012 : 07:57:19 AM
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A rose by any other name................?
John, I really hope this is successful.
My gut feeling though is that without a stand alone event it will just be more of the same.
Please prove me wrong. |
125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
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john
Forum Moderator
Victoria
3130 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jul 2012 : 10:27:59 AM
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| As I have said many times, riders need to earn another event by actually entering. The HMRAV has a good history of opening new races when the numbers appear. so once again, its up to the racers to enter and earn a new race by filling the grid. |
John Daley Sidecar #68
' there are those who do, those who dont do and those who undo. We must lampoon the latter." |
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john feakes
Advanced Member
Victoria
791 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jul 2012 : 5:02:25 PM
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John, that attitude is reactive.
To start something new needs a proactive approach.
To extend this to its illogical conclusion you could say that we will not organise a race meeting and let people know about it but when enough have gathered at the track we will organise one.
People will not turn up to take part in something that is not happening.
Create the event, advertise it and hopefully people will support it.
You can't lead from the rear. |
125 RIDERS' ALLIANCE
A wise person simplifies the complicated, a fool complicates the simple. |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 28 Jul 2012 : 10:57:19 AM
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This would have to be the best thunderbike I've seen except for Horner's Irving Vincent. I believe it is a 1998 Paul Smart Replica. I think it would give the Vincent a fright :
You must be logged in to see this link. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2012 : 07:14:59 AM
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It is interesting to see what is still around, but not racing. At this year's Broadford Bonanza there were three BSA Rob North 750cc triples, and really shmick Norton Commando. I know what my own bike sounds like, but this one was something else - I don't know how he keeps a bottom end in it. It sounded like it was on about 12 to one comp., and had a really radical cam. I've never seen it race.
I notice that Doug Gorrie's BSA rocket 3 still hasn't reappeared. Whenever I've seen him in recent years, he's been riding a little BSA single. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 15 Aug 2012 : 06:08:12 AM
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this would be good in a thunderbike class:
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Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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Jerry
Level 2 Member
South Australia
68 Posts |
Posted - 15 Aug 2012 : 07:56:28 AM
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| Dear Alan, The Laverda certainly is a nice Thunderbike. It is also P5 going by wheels and brakes alone. Fully sorted, developed and with the right jockey it may even be able to run towards the pointy end of racing in P5. All the best Jerry Kooistra |
Jerry |
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acotrel
Advanced Member
Victoria
2147 Posts |
Posted - 15 Aug 2012 : 09:39:52 AM
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Jerry, I really don't care what period the thunderbikes might run in, in normal historic racing. I'd be extremely happy to race against Ducati Monsters or Paul Smart Replicas. To me what is important is that everybody in races are using the same old two valve, aircooled four stroke technology engines, of much the same capacity. I feel the same way about two stroke races and superbike races - engine technology should be similar for all the bikes of each type when raced. It's the mix of thunderbikes, two strokes, and superbikes in our current road racing of all types historic, and modern, that does my head in. The races mean nothing, and don't even sound right.
My motor is 850cc, I should be racing against Buells, Sportsters, Pantahs, 900cc Ducatis, GUzzis, BMWs - all the stuff which usually stays at home because it is useless against two strokes and superbikes. |
Is your machine authentic or merely eligible? |
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Jerry
Level 2 Member
South Australia
68 Posts |
Posted - 15 Aug 2012 : 10:33:47 AM
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| Alan, I concur regarding similar technologies but I think it extends a bit further than just engines. there is the issue of brakes, whweels,tires, fuels etc. etc. There is also the issue of the Rule Book and then the competitor mindset of whether they are competing with or against (social riding or racing). I personally have no problems racing a 4 stroke 2 valve against 2 strokes of the same capacity. All the best Jerry |
Jerry |
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HMRAV Thunder Bike Series
